George Thomas 0:08
Ready to spend 15 minutes with the experts you admire need strategy sessions from thought leaders brought directly to your ears. Welcome to the sprocket talk 15 minute strategy podcast where every week George B Thomas uncovers the challenges that sales, marketing and service professionals face and of course, the strategies to help them overcome their biggest hurdles. So sit back and set your sights on growth with these bite sized conversations build your strategy goals. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the 15 minute strategy podcast all right sprocket talk viewers and listeners I am super excited and you know me I'm always excited but today this is going to dramatically change many of your businesses many of your minds the way that you think about doing business that's as much as I'm going to teach into this before I introduce our guest Dan tire, can you explain to the sprocket tears, who you are what you do and why You do it.
Dan Tyre 1:02
My name is Dan tyerman play number six at HubSpot. I've been a full time entrepreneur for the last 12 and a half years, right and I live in Scottsdale, Arizona, I travel the world. I'm on the road 70% of the time, speaking about the inbound revolution, and I love inbound. I'm a huge fan of George B Thomas sprocket. And all he tries to do in his podcast to make sure that we're doing good in the universe and we're helping people grow their businesses better.
George Thomas 1:33
There we go. growing businesses better and doing good in the universe and getting Dan tire to sing on the podcast check. We can be done for the day. Just kidding. sprocket tears.
Dan Tyre 1:45
Come on that there you go that in the briefing. Let's go there you go.
George Thomas 1:49
So here's the thing. Many of you may have heard about inbound marketing. Some of you may have heard about inbound sales. But today we want to take it another level, deeper, higher. Whatever You want to say and talk about inbound organizations and what that means. So Dan, when you go travel around the world and you're talking to folks about having or creating an inbound organization lay down kind of the foundation of what that means fundamentally, for those that might not know or be new to the term inbound.
Dan Tyre 2:21
Okay, so inbound is a thing, right? And it was invented by this guy, David meerman. Scott, who you know, who wrote the book called the new rules of PR marketing in 2007. And when he wrote the book, we're reading it, we like holy cow, we want to start a software company that reflects, he was the first person to but inbound in print in inbound is it sales and marketing tactics. And when I started, we had inbound marketing software, right, but it's really more of a management philosophy that has some common themes. That applies to more than just sales and marketing. Number one, you got to treat people like human beings. I know I sound like Gandhi, right? But that is get lost by so many different people. Number two, you've got to help rather than sell. Now, George B. Thomas, one of the reasons why I'm such a great fan is you provide all the service I've seen you, right? We're just doing this this morning, you are talking and educating 100 people on how to use video in the sales process out of the goodness of your heart. Right? And that's an inbound philosophy. So number one, be human. Number two, you help not sell. Number three, you have a centralized view of the customer, right? In the old days, like 1990, right? You were a generalist, right? You sold everybody today, the riches are in the niches right? And you figure out where you provide the best value. And then you work in that niche. Because in 2014, the average company had six competitors in 2019. It's 44 competitors, but there's so much other competition that if you niche very, very specifically, then you're going to be effective and of course the flywheel. Which is an essential part of the inbound organization is all about how you get your customers to help you create more customers. So as I do my public speaking, I do 50 speaking engagements a year. Turns out I'm mildly entertaining from the stage storage, you can appreciate that I spoken all the inbounds I was in Brazil, I was in South Africa this year, Dublin, added to Israel in two weeks. A super fun, right? People go Alright, I get it. I want to understand this inbound. I'm like, Alright, well, you got to do inbound, you need to be inbound. And they're like, okay, I want to be inbound. How do I do that? And essentially, you got to buy the book, or you got to read the inbound organization website, www inbound organizational website. And it will give you all the background understanding foundation leadership principles, so that you can then move to do the tactics, the sales and marketing kind of stuff, so you can grab it. Yeah, definitely
George Thomas 4:53
check out the website. definitely get the book and read that. What I want to do is I want to unpack there's so much goodness in that section right there, I love that you have to be inbound to do inbound. I love that. But one of the things that you referenced there, Dan was being able to niche or niche down, some people call it. And when you when you run it to an organization, and they're thinking about making this journey, what are some ways that they can actually figure out where they should be focused when they're kind of trying to niche down into a segment?
Dan Tyre 5:25
Sure. So the first thing I try to understand is a little bit about the organization and how they engage. Right. And you have a majority of companies, I'm saying are moving from the generalists a specific, so I want to understand where they provide the most value. I asked them, What's your ideal customer profile? I asked them, What are your ideal personas, what your audience knows all about? And then I'm like, What is your special sauce? Why do people like get so excited about working with you in that particular niche, and I was just working with this lady Beth Cochran, for Wire VR here in Phoenix and she's like, no, in b2b tech companies that are Phoenix based and I have $10 million. We kill it. We've never lost a customer. They love this. I'm like, okay, that's your niche, right? You work with b2b tech companies, software companies that have at least $10 million that have 30 employees that are trying to grow 100% Does that sound like you? And she's like dead. If we could get more of those. I go, how many of those are in Phoenix? She's like, 380. I'm like, okay, that's your target segment. Now, you can go to everybody or you can go to those three companies that you do unbelievable work. So number one, you think about where your best customers come from. Number two, you think about your background and experience, right? Because when you talk to people like you, George, you have the vocabulary, the understanding the background, right? It's hard like you understand marketers, you understand companies that scale that's, that's your authentic self, right? And when you walk into a room, everybody knows that You're trying, like, you're there's no hiding, right? If you walked into a, I don't know a psychology meetup or you walked into pharmaceutical conference, right? How would that play, it would just be a little different. You could do it. And there'll be lots of people you could educate. It's not the same as you walking into inbound. And people are like yelling at you. And that's what so that's the key in the old days, right? People don't do this because they think it will retard their growth there is going to be harder to grow. But the exact opposite takes place in 2018. The riches are in the niches you niche out. When you say they're not only working with this specific company, you explain why, and then you explain it. If you are really in another niche, you go talk to my buddy Remington or you go talk to my buddy Todd Hockenberry or you talk to Beth Cochran, something like that, you actually gain more credibility. You're seriously focused on the things that you want to do. You're providing all this value, and then you get a signal. target market share in that niche, then you just move to another niche. Right? And that sounds kind of simple, except when you're an entrepreneur and you're like, No, no, I need all that business. I got to make payroll. I'm like, okay, there's a balance between having to eat and then having to build that particular specialty. But specialty beats generalists, always my buddy Greg head, he runs a program called Greg's list, which is the top 495 lists of software companies in Dallas, Salt Lake City and in Phoenix, and he did it because he's like, Yeah, he's like, No, we need a list. He just did it. hundreds of hours of his own time. It's a great list. Right? It's a curated list. Right? And like, That's his specialty. That's where it goes.
George Thomas 8:47
Yeah, I love this and sprocket tears. If this is sounding a little familiar. You may remember in episode one where we talked to mark Schaefer and he mentioned knowing that statement of only we what's the thing our special or secret sauces. And only we do this thing and for these people, Dan, it's interesting because you kind of started to lean into one of the myths about inbound. And that leads me into wanting to ask the question when people think they know something, conversations get real fun and funky really quick. So when you think of people hearing this term inbound organization, what are some of the myths that you've had the battle from the stage when that becomes the conversation in the room?
Dan Tyre 9:29
Yeah, people think is blogging. People think of social media think people think it's like a marketing tech, right? They're like, I want a viral video. I'm like, good, so does everybody else and I'm like, No, no, inbound to me is a philosophy. It's like a religion. It's like a management leadership principle that helps you earn a competitive advantage. And they're like, okay, prove it. I'm like, I'm happy to prove it. Right. There are billions of people who are practicing inbound, right that are going to smoke you online because they're using the tactics of sales and marketing online. Right, they're helping not selling, right. They're providing incredible value. They're building relationships. We're talking about the tool and die show that Todd and I did. That's how Todd Hockenberry is that my co author, by the way, is the best co author in the history of books. Right? This guy is amazing. First of all, he's smart. He's a great writer. He's empathetic, right? He, when I'm like, freaking out with the big energies, like, calm down, dad, we would never have done this book without his help. And he's kind of funny. He's like, Dan, you live in the HubSpot bubble. And I'm like, what's up spot bubble? I'm like, you say things like everybody runs their business. Like I'm sweating. I'm like, well, he's lightweight example. George is like I go, Well, you put your m spot your m spot is your mission. Who you serve, that's the s. Your plays. That's what you're going to do your keys, your targets and your O's those your emissions and Appspot has had a spot for five years. Every HubSpot er has one page. If you go to www inbound organization comm, you see example of M SWAT, you can download the M spot template. And there's like 15 or 20 m spot examples. And if you build your m spot and send it to Titan, I will review it. Right just to make sure we're on the right page. And we do tons of consulting we did dozens of consulting engagements in 2019, about going in and doing a workshop so that people would build their own spot. And all of this and admission who you serve, your plays, your targets and omissions in one day, is hugely, like, effective, right, so that you can scale your business most people would prefer to work for a mission driven company, rather than like a regular company. And virtually every company can like establish a mission. That's this is what we're trying to do in the universe that's very, very inbound, right? So if you don't have an M spot or you Don't have like a wiki. Like you don't want a wiki is right here. Do your listeners know what a wiki wiki is?
George Thomas 12:07
I hope they know what it is. Okay,
Dan Tyre 12:08
okay. Don't don't don't be something because like I'm like, just posted on the wiki. And Todd's like, no one has a wiki. I'm like, What Todd brought to the table is that he's an industrial guy's a manufacturer. He has three patents on lasers. Right? The guy's like a rocket scientist. And he's like that. Come down into the real world. You're HubSpot. You have the M spot. You have the wiki, you have an inbound operating system, you practice inbound. No one has that. And I'm like, well, that's why we're writing the book. He goes, Yeah, but you got to write it in a way in which a regular person can understand it. Not like Okay, I got it. And so I had a very professional way he makes fun of me. And like, if you go to the www bound organization, website, you have all these like free resources that we offer you because if you become an inbound organization, you will have a huge competitive event. Yes. Six marketing tactics that you hire HubSpot partners for, yes, it's the sales motion that you hire our sales partners for. Yes, it's the alignment kind of stuff that you do and the way you train our partners and all that stuff, George, right. But it's also a way of viewing the world where you're going to help in you're not going to push that you're going to have one view of the customer. There's a chapter about inbound back office. And it turns out like your finance people, your accounts payable your legal department has an unbelievably positive or negative impact on whether people like you or not right and there's all these stories of like people who don't feel like they're customer facing who are definitely customer if you have a problem with your Verizon bill, and it gets fixed in seven minutes. What happens storage? Oh, you're excited, and you're a horizon fan forever. You're like Nana screw T Mobile, like you got to go Verizon. If you have a problem. With zoom, and they're like somebody cycles in and says, George, I want to make sure that you no longer on the zoom. You'll be like on and I'll be wearing a zoom t shirt all the time. You download like a an app and it doesn't work and you go into the support and they don't fix it in five days. What's going to happen?
George Thomas 14:16
Yeah, I'm gonna talk about I got it,
Dan Tyre 14:18
or you're an example of someone on a slide that's not necessary. So that inbound process and understanding how it goes to the entire organization is critically important. And that's what we tried to do. Right there's Jase, Justin champion wrote inbound content. That's like the nuts and bolts. Brian Cigna really wrote inbound selling. I actually wrote the foreword for that with Mark row bears. My first boss at appspot. That's about the sales motion. My friend Ileana sarebbe, great Bulgarian PR expert wrote inbound PR. What we wanted to do is take a little bit higher level to make sure that people understand the importance of a foundation. inbound organizations super excited about the output, super excited about helping more people. And I feel like I'm a little synonymous with HubSpot brand. Because I'm an old guy, I got a little gray hair. And everything changed for me in 2007 when I started to adopt these inbound principles, and I could definitively tell you, if you lean into inbound, you have a huge competitive edge. If you don't, I don't know what's gonna happen.
George Thomas 15:22
It's kind of Yeah, we'll get to that in a second because I have another question for you, Dan, it's interesting or sprockets. Here's what I'll say to you. Before I even go further with Dan here is, I hope you realize if you rewind that there was about four micro strategies inside the strategy of inbound organizations that just happened in that last segment. Dan, here's where I want to go next, other than also putting out in the universe that we should probably create an inbound video book that people would read, but yeah, there we go. But But here's the thing. What are some of the mistakes that you've seen people make when they start to transition from What is air quotes? Okay, those of you live a normal organization into an inbound organization.
Dan Tyre 16:06
So great. So when we started, everybody wanted to move and what we've quickly realized in the first two weeks, not everybody's ready to be an inbound organization, right? Some people say, what's your mission? The mission is to make more money. I'm like, that's not really a mission. It is a mission, but it's not like what you and I think would be a mission, right? But that's their mission. And I'm like, Okay, let's like noodle on how we take baby steps to get there. We have plenty of people we talk to this don't cocoa, they hire people right out of college, and they go go, I'm like, what's the return on investment on that? And they're like about 1%. I'm like, let me get this right. Is there any other part of your business, you spend 99 waste 99% of your time, effort and money and you'd still do it? And they're like, probably not. But like, this is how we grow our business. I'm like, what happens the other 99% I'm like that work in 1989 because there were six competitors. Now there's a million competitors. You're gonna get crushed. And they're like, good point, I'm like you got to become an inbound organism, you got to start with the philosophy, you've got to start with the foundation, you got to start with the management kind of characteristics. And that is a Tanaka very quote, to practice in down. You have to be in that time every, like 30 days would say something I would say, See, stop, hold on a second. What did you just say? And it was friggin brilliant. He said, Everybody wants to grow, but no one wants to change. And I'm like, oh, my goodness, that's like that should be on your tombstone or not to get more of that should be on your like wall and that got a lot of play on the blog. And like, I go, that's exactly right. Everybody has aspirations to but they don't have the baby steps. So number one, lots of people start at different areas and they take on too much too quick. Right? So you start with a you take the assessment, it's on the website, you get a percentage, or like a grade your inbound organization grades Then it will give you three recommendations of the next baby steps that you take. Number two, you're not always like not everybody jumps on the inbound bandwidth or the way you and I do George, right. We've been doing this for 10 years, we understand that it works. There's lots of people. They got this, like body language, right? their arms are crossed. They're like, that doesn't work with dentists, pharmaceuticals, salespeople, or doctors. And in fact, they're wrong. And I can prove it. But there is a method where you have to explain to them in their own terms, understand, like the options that they have, and a little bit of like the last 10 years and a little bit of future for us, right. If you're not in my organization, it's going to be a long, hard slog, because you've been out helping people for 10 years, right? Anybody who falls into your niche, they know who George Thomas is they know your expertise. They're naturally going to go we were on a call today, George with 150 people and I said George is on the call. George fanboy oh my goodness, I saw that. It was like a little embarrassing for me, but super cool for you. Right? And I'm like, yeah, that's why we brought George right. And that was unscripted. Those people were like, yeah, that's awesome. That's great. You work darn hard to do that, because you have an inbound philosophy. What I want to do is take a little George B Thomas little sprocket talk, I want to bring it to every single business, because if you don't adopt it, you're essentially screwed. Right. And this is the way businesses is done is the 21st century. There's hundreds of thousands of people who already started it. Whether you use HubSpot software or not, I don't care. Right? We just want you to like understand the philosophy. Number two, like if you want a real competitive advantage, you can use HubSpot software. Oh, by the way, it starts with free free software, who doesn't like free software? And number three, if you're going to delay, right, we just want you to understand the implications right? You can refuse to move into the 21st century but you do so. at your own risk, the risk isn't it's not going to work. We've already proven it. That's the last decade, the risk is you're going to try to convince yourself, it doesn't work. You're going to wait until I don't know 2024. And then you're going to jump in and you're like, Alright, it's time for this inbound stuff. Meanwhile, George Thomas has been doing it for 15 years, try to cut George Thomas off the first page of Google after he's been optimizing, offering help and cultivating a tribe for 15 years. It's not gonna be done. It's impossible. It's just forget about.
George Thomas 20:31
Well, Dan, thank you for the kind words, it's very humbling. And again, I'm just a guy trying to add value to the world just like you You are amazing. I love that you're going around and talking on space stages. I love that you have this inbound organization, conversation with people Dan, if people want to learn more about the inbound organization, if they want to talk more with you, where do you want to send them?
Dan Tyre 20:54
Yeah, you can get me anywhere. I am like all over the internet at Dan tire calm, you can go inbound Oregon. ization calm that's the site time I have up to bring all of this stuff into the universe. You can get me on LinkedIn Dan tire executive outside you can get me on twitter at Dan tire. Right if you want to see pictures of my food good Instagram and tire one, right anyplace you want I'm all over the place. I'm also accessible D tired. appspot.com I love helping people. I love being part ops. People say like you probably have a little bit of dough. Why do you stay with us? Because I friggin love it. Are you kidding me? I get to work with guys like you. We just did a program for 150 spot lions. Let me see your lion claws there, Roger. Yeah, I know. I have more fun than any other human being I am the luckiest guy in the world. HubSpot is great. Our ecosystem is great. The book is friggin awesome. It's so much fun to be me. And hopefully, right. You'll invite me back. We'll do another sprocket talk. Right. I'm all in for you, George and I'm all in for the sprocket talkers. That would be All
George Thomas 22:01
Dan Tyre 22:02
tears. Yeah, I'll sing the theme song if you want to record me I'm a bass player. So it's like you want to kind of think and write this is the right way to go. Right? It's like we know in our hearts, you are an ambassador before we put the term in them, right in our hearts. We know that helping people is the mission of the human like animal. And all we're trying to do is put words and processes to make Emory buddy embrace that be better human beings. And as Appspot says, hashtag robot.
George Thomas 22:32
Well, sprockets here's a couple of words you heard in this episode are have fun, be empathetic, add value. And of course, check out Dan's food on Instagram and we'll see you in the next episode. Did you enjoy this episode of the 15 minute strategy podcast we'd love to know. leave a rating and written review wherever you listen to your favorite shows and keep that learning going by visiting sprocket talk comm sign up for your free membership and in that membership area. You can find bundled apps Were we combined like strategies to help you grow better make the world better and share this episode with your friends and co workers who may be battling this same obstacle. You can always reach out to George Thomas on Twitter with questions or guest suggestions or just to talk about your favorite Marvel superhero and go out into the world and leverage this strategy for your success. And we'll see you on the next episode of the 15 minute strategy podcast.
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About the Expert
Dan Tyre joined HubSpot as a member of the original team in May of 2007, and has led the recruiting, training, and growth of HubSpots sales team with vigor. An authority on inbound marketing and sales, Dan is a regular speaker, writer, and coach to those who yearn for inbound success.
His favorite topic is the importance of attitude, and he's been known to bring the house down when speaking on this topic to groups.
George Thomas 0:08